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I’ve been hanging around Sojourner’s website. It’s one of those far left Christian sites that endorses redistribution of wealth (AKA taxing people to death) to solve the world’s poverty problems. The philosophy they espouse is called “social gospel”. It’s headed by a leftist minister/author whose hybrid concept of capitalism and socialism has made him famous among far Left Liberation Christians.
It’s different, than most Christian blogs. It attracts a variety of Christians: those who see the site leader as some kind of prophetic cult figure, some normal liberal thinking Christians, a self proclaimed “mystic” or two, an educated “non-theist Christian”, and the usual Religious Right whackos. Here’s the link if you want to check it out: http://www.sojo.net/blog/godspolitics/
But what’s not different is that the vast majority of them, from the guest blog authors through the commenting readers, is that hardly any of them understand scripture or refuse to apply it truthfully.
Oh, they love to quote verse. They will cut and paste and paraphrase it endlessly to support the thread topic’s political, social, or economic theme. The problem is it NEVER is an accurate interpretation of the genuine meaning of the scripture they are quoting. NEVER! Scripture is a tool to be adeptly manipulated.
When their misapplication, lack of understanding is pointed out, and their outright perversion of the verse to justify their argument is exposed, that’s when the fun begins. The labored excuses, the denial, the protestations, the accusations of being disrespectful, the invention of context, the anger, it’s remarkable to behold.
Take Paul’s admonishment in 1 Timothy which says women are not to preach, and must be silent in church. At this site the verse is denied as a prohibition against women as pastors, and twisted as an endorsement that women should be ministers. Yep, you read that right. At least two people insisted that Paul didn’t REALLY mean it for ALL churches … just Timothy’s church. How did they get that interpretation? Where was the scriptural evidence, the inference, the source document? Nope, nada… they got nothing. Why did the church fathers include 1Timothy in official canon if it was only for ONE church out of the hundreds? No answer… they just ignore and move on.
Another particularly vapid leftist Christian was bemoaning how the emergency “Wall Street Bailout” passed by congress will do nothing to spread the “Good News of economic security that Jesus promised the poor”. When I pointed out that the “Good News” Jesus spoke of had nothing to do with finance, but the spreading of the word of Jesus’ coming, the good news of God, salvation, the Kingdom, etc., and that it was mean to lift the burden of heavy spirit from the poor, not the burden of their economic plight… well, I may as well have been accused of being Satan himself.
It’s different, than most Christian blogs. It attracts a variety of Christians: those who see the site leader as some kind of prophetic cult figure, some normal liberal thinking Christians, a self proclaimed “mystic” or two, an educated “non-theist Christian”, and the usual Religious Right whackos. Here’s the link if you want to check it out: http://www.sojo.net/blog/godspolitics/
But what’s not different is that the vast majority of them, from the guest blog authors through the commenting readers, is that hardly any of them understand scripture or refuse to apply it truthfully.
Oh, they love to quote verse. They will cut and paste and paraphrase it endlessly to support the thread topic’s political, social, or economic theme. The problem is it NEVER is an accurate interpretation of the genuine meaning of the scripture they are quoting. NEVER! Scripture is a tool to be adeptly manipulated.
When their misapplication, lack of understanding is pointed out, and their outright perversion of the verse to justify their argument is exposed, that’s when the fun begins. The labored excuses, the denial, the protestations, the accusations of being disrespectful, the invention of context, the anger, it’s remarkable to behold.
Take Paul’s admonishment in 1 Timothy which says women are not to preach, and must be silent in church. At this site the verse is denied as a prohibition against women as pastors, and twisted as an endorsement that women should be ministers. Yep, you read that right. At least two people insisted that Paul didn’t REALLY mean it for ALL churches … just Timothy’s church. How did they get that interpretation? Where was the scriptural evidence, the inference, the source document? Nope, nada… they got nothing. Why did the church fathers include 1Timothy in official canon if it was only for ONE church out of the hundreds? No answer… they just ignore and move on.
Another particularly vapid leftist Christian was bemoaning how the emergency “Wall Street Bailout” passed by congress will do nothing to spread the “Good News of economic security that Jesus promised the poor”. When I pointed out that the “Good News” Jesus spoke of had nothing to do with finance, but the spreading of the word of Jesus’ coming, the good news of God, salvation, the Kingdom, etc., and that it was mean to lift the burden of heavy spirit from the poor, not the burden of their economic plight… well, I may as well have been accused of being Satan himself.
That the explanation of “good news” I provided is corroborated by every Christian biblical site on the web, and every knowledgeable biblical scholar, and was documented for him, was of no importance to him. That there is zero reference to economic security, or raising the poor from their financial plight, or governmental intervention in wealth redistribution to benefit the poor anywhere in scripture doesn’t mean a thing to him.
Basically what it comes down to is some combination of outright ignorance, or intentional distortion in order to support an agenda. Hey, if they can use the bible to justify anything from slavery, to disenfranchising homosexuals, to anti-Semitism, to anti Choice, why not distort it in support of confiscatory taxation to support the poor. And while you’re at it, convince yourself you know what you’re talking about.
Basically what it comes down to is some combination of outright ignorance, or intentional distortion in order to support an agenda. Hey, if they can use the bible to justify anything from slavery, to disenfranchising homosexuals, to anti-Semitism, to anti Choice, why not distort it in support of confiscatory taxation to support the poor. And while you’re at it, convince yourself you know what you’re talking about.
Christian ignorance of scripture and their intellectual dishonesty is more than skin deep. It goes right down to the bone.
UPDATE 10/7/08: Evidently pointing out textual criticism of the scripture, & correcting fake use of scriptural verse to support their idealogy is not welcome. I've been banned from commenting on Sojourners. So much for Christian tolerance :)
10 comments:
You mean 'the last shall be first' doesn't mean that the Bengals will move to first place and win the Superbowl?
Damn.
Heehehe..!
i know for a fact Jesus hates the Bengals. They shall be last here AND in paradise. Heck, they won't even get ONE virgin between them when they arrive there.
Double damn.
Um, I'm pretty sure if Mr. Christ could turn water into wine, he'll be pouring out the gold dubloons for them there poor folk pretty soon now. That bailout was obviously a sign of faith lacking, and we all know the big guy isn't a fan... congress has ruined it for all of us.
"Congress has ruined it all for us"
I submit that the administration/congress tried to apply a $700,000,000,000 band aid to a problem due to UNREGULATED capitalism that among other things rewarded purveyors (CEO’s) of collateralized debt obligations that will cost TRILLIONS...
The bailout has nothing to do with God(s) – it has everything to do with greed, stupidity and desperation of a group of humans. Humans around the world made the mess and it will be humans around the world who will have to deal with it.
- Fastthumbs
Joyce, no. The Bengals will not move to first place. The Raiders will.
Smiles
Oreo
Oreo ... lol.
"UPDATE 10/7/08: Evidently pointing out textual criticism of the scripture, & correcting fake use of scriptural verse to support their idealogy is not welcome. I've been banned from commenting on Sojourners. So much for Christian tolerance :)"
Just curious which thread got ya banned - I wanna see it...
- Fastthumbs
Fast,
I don't remember the title, it had quite a few comments. I was explaining to this clown (who has a picture of an old bald man for his avatar) that a translation he kept using to support his political agenda (which it seems is what they like to do there)has been deemed erroneous by almost every Biblical scholar. I told him he could check the greek translation at Strongs for the proper english word that the KJV had wrong.
Next thing you know he claims to be a greek scholar, and repeats back to me what I said verbatim (he cut and paste it from Strongs), as though his wrong perspectiuve and his multiple objections to my pointing out a scriptural disconnect over five posts never even occured!!
Naturally I called him disengenuous and intellectually dishonest... because now he took my position as his own.
Some other regular (carl something ot other)came to his defense saying i was "out of line and over my head", whatever the fuck that means, since my knowledge of scripture far exceeded anyone else there (which i told him in so many words); and that if supporting dishonesty is the preferred route to supporting learned scholarship that is of course his perogative.
An hour later I couldn't post.
It seems if you are "flagged" by a regular, as I must have been more than once, they eventually boot you.
I am unsurprised, since an atheist with a knowledge of scriture isn't exactly welcome to correct "the faithful" when they want to use scripture to make a point. even if the point is invalid, or the meaning of the scripture erroneously used.
Ah..i do remeber the verse though..it was about how nations would stand before god in judgement.
he said that proves that governments have the duty to help the poor. I explained that the greek word for nations meant people, especially pagans, and usually not Jews. The bible.org concordance I gave him the link to specfically said the scirpture does not mean governmental body, or ruling powers, only people in general since salvation can only come to people, and not to a government. They showed the greek word for nations meaning peoples of all other creeds [except Jews].
any way, its moot.
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